Greetings... I have a question! :D

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Offline vrana

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« on: February 15, 2018, 11:15:48 AM »
Greetings from Austria,

Just call me vrana,
I try to get in touch with Mandelbulb, it pretty fascinates me...
Launched a 2D Mandelbrot zoom with Python a while ago...

But one thing really interests me... Do you know about female Mandelbulb Designers, or puplications about a lack of diversity in this field?

...and something else, according to the curator Klaus Ottman (about 1989, found in John Briggs - Chaos), Computer Art like the Mandelbrot Zooms in the 80ies, 90ies should be called an "activity" it is not
an art-form. Because things a computer generated, there is no human spirit in it... do you know more about discussions like these?

Maybe I will find a lot here on my own, but please feel free to inform me, if you know something...

Thanks to everybody who is working here, a wonderfull and miraculous please... I like it!

All the best

Offline Sockratease

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« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2018, 11:39:35 AM »
Hello and Welcome to the forums  O0

I don't think I ever saw any gender for any Mandelbulb designers.  For all I know, Jesse (the creator of the original MB3D) was a woman since the name is androgynous.

That said, I suspect there is an imbalance but nobody discriminates or chooses their software based on the gender of the programmer.

We welcome everyone from any country or gender identity  :yes:

...and something else, according to the curator Klaus Ottman (about 1989, found in John Briggs - Chaos), Computer Art like the Mandelbrot Zooms in the 80ies, 90ies should be called an "activity" it is not
an art-form. Because things a computer generated, there is no human spirit in it... do you know more about discussions like these?

It's an age old argument- "Is it Art?"

Here's a good thread in our Archive that addresses this :'art'/

Feel free to restart that discussion here!

I maintain that people trying to define Art are just being silly.

Of course it's Art!

I hear the same thing about using 3D Software.  But nobody questions if it's Art when Hollywood does it.

Here's my favorite answer I ever gave to this question, and it's in the thread I linked to above:

I say Art is a Thing To Do, not a thing unto itself.

It's the process, not the final product.  Nothing you can point to is Art.  It's just, at best, the leftovers from Art.  Art Droppings, I like to call it.

So if you want an example related to Fractal Art, Art is what happens during the time spent setting up something to render, and what happens during any post-work.  What you get in the end is a picture.  The picture is not the Art.  The Art is the process of making it.

Some people try to do a thing they call Performance Art, but that is just Art in my world.  They just do it for an audience.

I believe anytime somebody calls any thing Art, they are misusing the word.  The phrase "a work of Art" is quite common.  That implies that Art is Work.  Work is definitely a Verb and never confused with a noun!

Frankly, I'm surprised this is not the universal definition of Art, as it would quell thousands of debates over whether or not something is Art.  I see such questions as meaningless misuses of language.

Here's a motto for us all - Ask not whether a thing is Art, ask instead if you like it!
Study stupidity, kids. It's not getting smarter out there - Frank Zappa

Offline vrana

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« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2018, 11:58:58 AM »
Thank you for the warm reception Sockratease! ;)

I am not looking for discimination issues, I am looking for a diversity. Because things are differently done, depending to the authors gender.
It is interesting to compare the results and looking for similarities or differences.

To the term: What is Art?

I know it is a neverending story, Art is simply Art, it is just a word for a human way to display something and it doesn't matter what it is.
I totally agree with your definition, very good words!

Like you, I think the process is Art, because you decide colour, map, perspective, fog and you translate a hidden subconscious meaning into your rendered artwork. I think most times aesthetic parameters of your self rule the way you choose your rendering... but good for now, I will browse through the link you have sent me, maybe I will find some conclusions. :)

...after some research I will open a discussion!

Thanks a lot!

Offline Fraktalist

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« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2018, 03:05:48 PM »
I totally agree with Sock here (mark that one in your calendar! ;)

And with you too, vrana! (welcome btw!)

Indeed the process is what is creating art. and fractal formulas are just a pencil/brush/canvas. just another medium.
I created this video some time ago to illustrate that point:
If there is noone to decide where to zoom, there is no image. even though all possibilities already exist in theory inside z->z?+c.
But so do all alternate universes in theory - the only one that matters though is the one that is actually unfolding along with your life-decisions.

Fractal software is just another tool - a very elaborate one, and very hard to actually master, but it's just a tool.

the nice thing about the tool is that even if you just zoom randomly you often create very aesthetically pleasing images.
but do achive certain shapes and forms on purpose you need to be in control of the tools and few do that. and that imho is when it really becomes art.

Offline spain2points

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« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2018, 06:01:32 PM »
It's art if you want it to be. I can recognize an artist, it's fairly easy. Just browse thru his/her portfolio. A person can produce a one hit wonder, that's for sure, but not a whole body of work -intriguing, eloquent, captivating- if there's not any kind of talent, of vision, behind it all. So all these programs are just tools. This discussion reminds a lot the one that took place in the early years of photography, and the people that had to work really hard to make the public understand that the camera does not produce art by itself, just by clicking a button.

Offline vrana

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« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2018, 10:20:36 PM »
Guys you are amazing!
Wonderful video, I wasn't able to get this range!!! Thumps Up!!!

It was one of the first things that came into my mind... Photography and Fine Art... and a huge problem to define, even in those days.
When you think about Walter Ruttmann and compare it with Walter Benjamins "The Work of Art in the Age of mechanical Reproduction", you will recognize the same issue with moving pictures some years later. I think this 3-4 dimensional fractals are bringing pretty the same debate, just more accurate, but there is a lot of space to explore and nobody has reached the edge now :) glad to be a spectator of this phenomenon. :)

I am browsing through debates right now, hopefully I can open up a threat next days. :)

I recently found this one

it was presented at Ars Electronica Animation Festival (one of the biggest in Central Europe, I think last year, cannot promise) by the Polish collective MELT
... fractal "art" projects are close to be recognised by a broader audience these days I guess... really addicted me with this :D

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